I don’t. When I say social change I’m more talking about like social thinking that individuals are the problem. Sorry if that was not clear.

Yeah, it’s different. I think the machine on the left is an infinite energy machine. Those will never work.

The machine on the right is a carbon capture machine which does work. But not well enough. Are fast enough to solve any of the problems that we have.

I’m fine with playing around with a carbon capture machine and seeing if we can improve it, but I would never want to rely solely on it.

I want to try a thousand solutions to the global warming problem. Including societal and government changes. Cuz you know otherwise we all die.

A person can’t inform others faster than the speed of light.

Teacher: I meant the global we. So it would average out to 8 minutes.

https://youtu.be/o_PBfLbd3zw

there is room for them having reasons not to get help

What? Why should there be reasons for that? They are traumatized and being antisocial like sending death threats.

and room for them to get help but not improve.

Yes, this how most therapy is. Once you are traumatized, that is it. You get to go though life traumatized. Therapy will help by reducing negative reactions, giving tools to deal with negative reactions in a way that doesn’t harm yourself or others. You have to do the work. You still have to deal with the consequences of your actions before and after therapy. There is no time limit except for the longer you do antisocial stuff, the longer you and others will need to deal with the consequences.

Where I draw a hard line is creating cultural excuses and encouragement for retaliation and instigation, which I believe you have done by saying it’s fine for women to intentionally instigate men to cause insult.

By “fine” I meant it is reasonable to do giving the circumstances.

What I can say for sure is that I strongly oppose politics that try to excuse harming groups just because they’re less harmed than other groups.

I think we should not excuse or encourage people intentionally harming other people.

These are fine statements, but historically doing nothing often make these problems worse. If you looks at the civil rights in the US, for example. If black people didn’t start causing a scene, they wouldn’t have made any progress. The long term outcomes of not doing anything in response to antisocial behavior is that you get walked over.

Rather, we should focus on creating uplifting spaces where people of all genders are brought together across divides to focus on common goals and interests. This helps humanize the other and reduce social tension.

If the professionals agree, sure, but this should be a government project. You don’t want traumatized men, women, or feminists building such a system, otherwise it will probably not turn out well.

“Get help” is not so simple, and is a patronizing, individualist thing to say to people who are having trauma responses to bodyshaming.

I agree that it isn’t always simple to do. I didn’t mean it in a patronizing way, I meant it in a matter of fact way. Do you not suggest people who are having trauma responses to every hand gesture that mimics a pinch? Clearly they need to get help or they are going to be constantly in a trauma response their entire life by people who mean them no offense. It’s a pretty sad way to live, so much potential wasted.

I have gotten help and it has improved my situation drastically. I would suggest anyone give it a try.

And I think it’s fine for men to then bodyshame women in turn. But – oh wait – making excuses for bodyshaming doesn’t actually improve anything. It just increases tension and resentment.

I think if you make the claim that men have human limitations and can’t help but to retaliate or instigate, you need to hold that claim for women as well. We are all humans just doing our best. This whole thing has been made super public and both sides have been hurt. So the fallout is unavoidable here. Why should women be expected to hold the civility line when men are having trauma responses to perceived body shaming?

It’s been a bit since I have looked into the situation but last time I check several artists are out of a job and business are scared because of a pinch gesture. The retaliation has been feminists who actually mean to body shame. Has there been anything else? Have any body shamed men lost money, jobs, or their lively hood?

All this to say, from where I am standing the traumatized men are still a head here.

There are more choices than just these two.

I never implied there were only two choices. There are many options. I think picking the “returning fire” option is reasonable.

But maybe I am missing a better option. If you have a suggestion, please make it.

I feel like we’re kind of in the weeds here so I’m going to state my position openly. I’m a man who has been accused of having a small penis many times in life. I say this to communicate that I understand what it’s like to be accused of having a small penis and I get it.

Any man who thinks that a pinching motion is unquestionably making fun of them for having a small penis with our out confirmation, needs to get help. That motion is done all the time by all genders for any particular reason. Any man who causes harm because someone said he has a small penis also needs help. If you need help and you don’t get help and continue to behave in antisocial manner, then you deserve to be made fun of. At a certain point, antisocial behavior needs to be handled.

If a large enough group of men are being antisocial because of a pinching motion. I think it’s fine for feminists to make the pinching motion intentionally to cause insult. For women to have to just deal with the antisocial behavior and ignore it is not acceptable.

My opinions would be the same if the genders would be reversed, so I feel like I’ve got a pretty solid argument here.

Yes, but that didn’t happen here.

Yeah, the only outcome I can see from this is everyone is given a choice to stay and shut up or leave if they disagree with the new direction. Most will chose, the people who stay behind to cause trouble will be removed shortly after and then business will return to normal.

You forgot about asking your employees to bring their own toilet paper. That saves a couple bucks.

“Beware he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master.” - Commisioner Pravin Lal, Alpha Centauri (game from Firaxis)

That game was full of many bangers!

And I love them for it. Seriously comfortable society is built on and by nerds.

Because the average person doesn’t have any real time to think deeply about politics. They believe whatever big media tells them. Some also can’t understand how evil someone people can get.

“Surely the basic logic of how things work must be very consistent in order to have such a large and prosperous country like the USA. I don’t understand it. Probably because I’m missing something not because it’s fundamentally flawed”

It also doesn’t help that they are working to improve it all the time.

Doom music starts to play and you realize you’re not the main character…

You’re the only one talking about suicide here.

I still think a good chunk of the code will be visible. You can have all the code up to the point where you call the proprietary function. Obviously you won’t get to see what’s inside that function but you can guess. Also, a lot of proprietary libraries have that functionality really well documented.

I don’t think so, seems like I am a part of a rag-tag group of people who are doing “jobs” to get rich. I don’t think we have any formal government or organization backing.

I guess I don’t know the full story of everyone I am working with yet. So there could be a twist I am unaware of.

Cataclysm Dark Days Ahead

https://cataclysmdda.org/

Zombie survival roguelike. It’s free, open source, and a mature project.